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Hey everyone!

Just played though the re-translation of Phantasy Star with a emulator and something hit me that i dont think i ever picked up on before when i played it though many times (on the regular version) on my PAL master system.

The game uses the left border to do something else than just display a sollid color when in the menu screen, and that kind of made me wonder.. Are there other games that makes use of the borders to display more than just a solid color (like in Sonic)? i know the c64 has games that makes use of this feature quite abit (examples of this: Wizball) but did the master system developers use it the same way though clever programming? or is Phantasy Star the lone example?

Off my head I can think of California Games and Gangster Town changing the border color once during the frame. Nothing particularly amazing but they do it.

Choplifter

The fantastic Yu Suzuki's Space Harrier, Space Harrier 3D @Dybdal talking about Phantasy Star I think you meant that leftmost bar that most of the games suffer and It doesnt show up in the menu screen, there are some particular cases that dont suffer from that.

For example the only horizontal scroll game I know that doesn't have that leftmost bar is Golden Axe and for vertical scroll we have Secret Commando, the screen by screen games don't suffer from that bar aswell such as Golden Axe Warrior, Zillion (in some stages) and so on.

I think if there would be hacks that use the borders, the most suitable would be the third person driving/racing games such as Outrun (another Yu Suzuki's), Road Rash

Yes, the original question seems to mean games using the full 256 pixel width, which by definition means games not using horizontal scrolling (in the usual sense, Golden Axe being unusual). That quickly excludes most games, but some with vertical only segments comply - Alex Kidd in Miracle World being a prime example.

This leftmost column is not visible, or only partially visible, on most contemporary TVs, so making it visible at all is a minor benefit to the game.

Border colour changes are what a few others mention in this thread, and they are the extent of any drawing into the borders. The tricks on the C64 don't have equivalents on the SMS VDP.

What i mean is the border on the left side of the screen being utilized to display any sort of graphic that isnt a solid color.

Watch the video when he goes from a town to his menu screen, the green border on the side isnt there anymore and it's being used to display the very left side of the menu screen instead.

This also happens on other systems that has such borders like the c64.

http://www.c64endings.freeolamail.com/endings/w/wizball/wizball1.png
Wizball uses the top of its border to display the power-up section and that isnt an easy feat to do.

From what i've gathered so far, there are quite abit of intro splash screens that uses the black border on the master system to center an image in all black but Phantasy Star is the only one so far i've come aross that has gameplay areas using the entire screen (left border included)

Dybdal wrote

What i mean is the border on the left side of the screen being utilized to display any sort of graphic that isnt a solid color.

There's no way to display anything 'outside' the main 256x<screen height> area, except for border color changes, AFAIK.

In theory you could write to CRAM to manipulate the borders, but I suspect it wouldn't work too well. Maybe by some messing with modes you could trick it into drawing past the end of the usual area, but I suspect the result would be an invalid signal.

Phantasy Star has lots of static screens (monster battles, dungeons, building interiors) where it goes full width, but the overworld segments mask the border because that's when the scrolling happens. There's no tricks, just extra work to display pixels most people won't see...

You can also mention the extended height video modes, as used in Micro Machines for example. They are incompatible with older systems, which is why Sega never used them.

Maxim wrote

In theory you could write to CRAM to manipulate the borders, but I suspect it wouldn't work too well. Maybe by some messing with modes you could trick it into drawing past the end of the usual area, but I suspect the result would be an invalid signal.

Phantasy Star has lots of static screens (monster battles, dungeons, building interiors) where it goes full width, but the overworld segments mask the border because that's when the scrolling happens. There's no tricks, just extra work to display pixels most people won't see...

You can also mention the extended height video modes, as used in Micro Machines for example. They are incompatible with older systems, which is why Sega never used them.

Thats interresting, thanks for the detailed reply.
Can you elaborate on Micro Machines? When you say "older systems" are you referring to the master system it self? or TV's?

The Master System itself. Basically, the VDP commonly used in the SMS2 supports two more graphic settings, with more lines. There are detailed topics about that on this forum, if you want to venture yourself into the search engine.

Author	Message
Dybdal Joined: 20 Apr 2016 Posts: 12	What games makes use of the Master System borders? Posted: Sun May 01, 2016 11:02 am
Dybdal Joined: 20 Apr 2016 Posts: 12	Hey everyone! Just played though the re-translation of Phantasy Star with a emulator and something hit me that i dont think i ever picked up on before when i played it though many times (on the regular version) on my PAL master system. The game uses the left border to do something else than just display a sollid color when in the menu screen, and that kind of made me wonder.. Are there other games that makes use of the borders to display more than just a solid color (like in Sonic)? i know the c64 has games that makes use of this feature quite abit (examples of this: Wizball) but did the master system developers use it the same way though clever programming? or is Phantasy Star the lone example?

Bock Site Admin Joined: 08 Jul 2001 Posts: 8652 Location: Paris, France	Posted: Sun May 01, 2016 9:21 pm
	Off my head I can think of California Games and Gangster Town changing the border color once during the frame. Nothing particularly amazing but they do it.

asynchronous Joined: 14 Aug 2000 Posts: 742 Location: Adelaide, Australia	What games makes use of the Master System borders? Posted: Thu May 05, 2016 12:22 pm
	Choplifter

FeRcHuLeS Joined: 22 Mar 2015 Posts: 228	Posted: Thu May 05, 2016 8:39 pm
FeRcHuLeS Joined: 22 Mar 2015 Posts: 228	The fantastic Yu Suzuki's Space Harrier, Space Harrier 3D @Dybdal talking about Phantasy Star I think you meant that leftmost bar that most of the games suffer and It doesnt show up in the menu screen, there are some particular cases that dont suffer from that. For example the only horizontal scroll game I know that doesn't have that leftmost bar is Golden Axe and for vertical scroll we have Secret Commando, the screen by screen games don't suffer from that bar aswell such as Golden Axe Warrior, Zillion (in some stages) and so on. I think if there would be hacks that use the borders, the most suitable would be the third person driving/racing games such as Outrun (another Yu Suzuki's), Road Rash

Maxim Site Admin Joined: 19 Oct 1999 Posts: 14745 Location: London	Posted: Thu May 05, 2016 8:45 pm Last edited by Maxim on Fri May 06, 2016 11:14 am; edited 1 time in total
	Yes, the original question seems to mean games using the full 256 pixel width, which by definition means games not using horizontal scrolling (in the usual sense, Golden Axe being unusual). That quickly excludes most games, but some with vertical only segments comply - Alex Kidd in Miracle World being a prime example. This leftmost column is not visible, or only partially visible, on most contemporary TVs, so making it visible at all is a minor benefit to the game. Border colour changes are what a few others mention in this thread, and they are the extent of any drawing into the borders. The tricks on the C64 don't have equivalents on the SMS VDP.

Dybdal Joined: 20 Apr 2016 Posts: 12	Posted: Fri May 06, 2016 8:55 am
Dybdal Joined: 20 Apr 2016 Posts: 12	What i mean is the border on the left side of the screen being utilized to display any sort of graphic that isnt a solid color. Watch the video when he goes from a town to his menu screen, the green border on the side isnt there anymore and it's being used to display the very left side of the menu screen instead. This also happens on other systems that has such borders like the c64. http://www.c64endings.freeolamail.com/endings/w/wizball/wizball1.png Wizball uses the top of its border to display the power-up section and that isnt an easy feat to do. From what i've gathered so far, there are quite abit of intro splash screens that uses the black border on the master system to center an image in all black but Phantasy Star is the only one so far i've come aross that has gameplay areas using the entire screen (left border included)

sverx Joined: 05 Sep 2013 Posts: 3828 Location: Stockholm, Sweden	Posted: Fri May 06, 2016 9:23 am
	Dybdal wrote What i mean is the border on the left side of the screen being utilized to display any sort of graphic that isnt a solid color. There's no way to display anything 'outside' the main 256x<screen height> area, except for border color changes, AFAIK.

Maxim Site Admin Joined: 19 Oct 1999 Posts: 14745 Location: London	Posted: Fri May 06, 2016 11:13 am
	In theory you could write to CRAM to manipulate the borders, but I suspect it wouldn't work too well. Maybe by some messing with modes you could trick it into drawing past the end of the usual area, but I suspect the result would be an invalid signal. Phantasy Star has lots of static screens (monster battles, dungeons, building interiors) where it goes full width, but the overworld segments mask the border because that's when the scrolling happens. There's no tricks, just extra work to display pixels most people won't see... You can also mention the extended height video modes, as used in Micro Machines for example. They are incompatible with older systems, which is why Sega never used them.

Dybdal Joined: 20 Apr 2016 Posts: 12	Posted: Sat May 07, 2016 8:36 am
Dybdal Joined: 20 Apr 2016 Posts: 12	Maxim wrote In theory you could write to CRAM to manipulate the borders, but I suspect it wouldn't work too well. Maybe by some messing with modes you could trick it into drawing past the end of the usual area, but I suspect the result would be an invalid signal. Phantasy Star has lots of static screens (monster battles, dungeons, building interiors) where it goes full width, but the overworld segments mask the border because that's when the scrolling happens. There's no tricks, just extra work to display pixels most people won't see... You can also mention the extended height video modes, as used in Micro Machines for example. They are incompatible with older systems, which is why Sega never used them. Thats interresting, thanks for the detailed reply. Can you elaborate on Micro Machines? When you say "older systems" are you referring to the master system it self? or TV's?

Tom Joined: 16 May 2002 Posts: 1356 Location: italy	Posted: Sat May 07, 2016 10:09 am
Tom Joined: 16 May 2002 Posts: 1356 Location: italy	The Master System itself. Basically, the VDP commonly used in the SMS2 supports two more graphic settings, with more lines. There are detailed topics about that on this forum, if you want to venture yourself into the search engine.

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