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Last time I was checking through Mercado Livre for Brazilian games to add to my collection, I stumbled across a bunch of reproduction games getting cranked out in Brazil. Naturally, I had to get my hands on The Goonies.

I gotta say, it looks pretty legit. They put some effort into presentation here.

It got me thinking. I know that on this site only official releases of games seem to be cataloged, but I'm strongly under the impression that a good number of Korean games aren't official releases or are ports of games that were ported without permission. It got me wondering what the criteria is on SMSPower for determining whether a game is worthy of official documentation or is simply dismissed as a homebrew, repro, or bootleg. I'm wondering if maybe we shouldn't be taking a second look at some of these games.

I'm not looking to complain or stir up trouble, merely a bit curious as to what the criteria is for whether a game does or doesn't get an informational page on this site. Speaking personally, I know my copy of 188 Hap is so glitchy that it's barely playable. I'm not sure what qualifies it for an entry on this site over one of the more polished cartridges being sold on 2Minds, or a copy of Jumping Llama put out by Revo. I'm really curious for some input here.

20240522_041729.jpg (3.1 MB)

Case Front

20240522_041807.jpg (2.93 MB)

Outer Case

20240522_041831_remastered.jpg (3.3 MB)

Cartridge

20240522_041844_remastered.jpg (2.57 MB)

Cartridge Back

The main criteria for cataloguing something under Games/ is whether it was released during the era the system was commercially active. The number of software falling into this criteria in theoretically finite. That means we do try to document bootlegs released in the 90s (e.g. HTH GG releases).

Everything else that constitute new software is under Homebrew/ and modifications of existing software under Hacks/. I think it's a good split that align with the initial preservation intent of this website.

Nowadays some database use the term "Aftermarket" to refer to any modern releases, I think it's a good term and align with my description above.

Whereas the number of software falling into Games/ is finite by definition (and even so, it has been a multi-decade project to find and document them, and we are not done), aftermarket software are only going to grow forever. There are a true gems and labors of love out there, but I think it is viable that we draw a line somewhere in term of how we cover them.

Normal copies of 188 Hap should work, sorry yours doesn't :(
Which system are you running it on?

Bock wrote

The main criteria for cataloguing something under Games/ is whether it was released during the era the system was commercially active. The number of software falling into this criteria in theoretically finite. That means we do try to document bootlegs released in the 90s (e.g. HTH GG releases).

Everything else that constitute new software is under Homebrew/ and modifications of existing software under Hacks/. I think it's a good split that align with the initial preservation intent of this website.

Nowadays some database use the term "Aftermarket" to refer to any modern releases, I think it's a good term and align with my description above.

Whereas the number of software falling into Games/ is finite by definition (and even so, it has been a multi-decade project to find and document them, and we are not done), aftermarket software are only going to grow forever. There are a true gems and labors of love out there, but I think it is viable that we draw a line somewhere in term of how we cover them.

Normal copies of 188 Hap should work, sorry yours doesn't :(
Which system are you running it on?

I'm tempted to play devil's advocate and point out that they're still cranking out Master Systems in Brazil to this day, if we're talking commercially active. I still can't believe the Master System beat the Atari 2600's record.

i don't even remember the nature of the issues I had with 188 Hap, as they drove me away from playing it and I haven't touched it in a long while. I think I just encountered a lot of glitches when attempting to play it, maybe some locking up or rebooting. I remember having the impression that maybe some of the games would have worked out just fine if it wasn't a multicart.

The King of the Mods wrote

I'm tempted to play devil's advocate and point out that they're still cranking out Master Systems in Brazil to this day, if we're talking commercially active

Although at this point they're basically emulation boxes (and poor emulation boxes at that) that don't actually play original cartridges.

The King of the Mods wrote

I'm tempted to play devil's advocate and point out that they're still cranking out Master Systems in Brazil to this day, if we're talking commercially active.

I guess if TecToy released a new game today I believe we would add it, just like we added https://www.smspower.org/Games/GGAleste3-GG, because I think it has some legitimacy, that a random Goonies repro on ML doesn't have. I realize there's an elements of arbitrary and common-sense choice there to be made anyhow. It's not so important to discuss, I think intuitively you would understand why some items would fit in and some wouldn't.

Let me play devil's advocate here but I would probably add any commercially released game, maybe with some tag to mark that as 'modern' release (after some specific threshold we should somehow decide...)?

I mean, one could argue that 2Minds release are 'homebrew', but would they forever be? What if someone release a new SMS game, would that be an 'homebrew' even if that was a commercial project from the start?

I know there's no real solution...

We already add them to Homebrew. That specific labeling doesn't matter much, it's fine that they are "commercial".

We are far from having accomplished our primary mission to preserve retro games, so as a way to juggle our resources and priorities I think it is important we don't cover modern games the same way.

Bock wrote

The King of the Mods wrote

I'm tempted to play devil's advocate and point out that they're still cranking out Master Systems in Brazil to this day, if we're talking commercially active.

I guess if TecToy released a new game today I believe we would add it, just like we added https://www.smspower.org/Games/GGAleste3-GG, because I think it has some legitimacy, that a random Goonies repro on ML doesn't have. I realize there's an elements of arbitrary and common-sense choice there to be made anyhow. It's not so important to discuss, I think intuitively you would understand why some items would fit in and some wouldn't.

So the batch of games included with the Master System Evolution would warrant an entry then?

The King of the Mods wrote

Bock wrote

The King of the Mods wrote

I'm tempted to play devil's advocate and point out that they're still cranking out Master Systems in Brazil to this day, if we're talking commercially active.

I guess if TecToy released a new game today I believe we would add it, just like we added https://www.smspower.org/Games/GGAleste3-GG, because I think it has some legitimacy, that a random Goonies repro on ML doesn't have. I realize there's an elements of arbitrary and common-sense choice there to be made anyhow. It's not so important to discuss, I think intuitively you would understand why some items would fit in and some wouldn't.

So the batch of games included with the Master System Evolution would warrant an entry then?

In theory yes, but we also tend to handle "spammy" cases differently and it seems like it would be one of those cases where we would likely create one page grouping all the games. Also to cope with the complexity that there are multiple SMS Evolution and they are likely to have varying software.

https://www.smspower.org/Games/HiComTheBestGameCollection-SMS
https://www.smspower.org/Games/SegaMasterSystemRom-SMS

Bock wrote

The King of the Mods wrote

Bock wrote

The King of the Mods wrote

I'm tempted to play devil's advocate and point out that they're still cranking out Master Systems in Brazil to this day, if we're talking commercially active.

I guess if TecToy released a new game today I believe we would add it, just like we added https://www.smspower.org/Games/GGAleste3-GG, because I think it has some legitimacy, that a random Goonies repro on ML doesn't have. I realize there's an elements of arbitrary and common-sense choice there to be made anyhow. It's not so important to discuss, I think intuitively you would understand why some items would fit in and some wouldn't.

So the batch of games included with the Master System Evolution would warrant an entry then?

In theory yes, but we also tend to handle "spammy" cases differently and it seems like it would be one of those cases where we would likely create one page grouping all the games. Also to cope with the complexity that there are multiple SMS Evolution and they are likely to have varying software.

https://www.smspower.org/Games/HiComTheBestGameCollection-SMS
https://www.smspower.org/Games/SegaMasterSystemRom-SMS

However it's done, I think Acerte o Alvo, Aquaduto, Arqueiro, Ataque dos Vermes, Aventuras na Floresta, Batalha Animal, Batalha no Mar, Bolas e Cores, Bolhas, Bombeiros, Cava Cava, Creature Capture, Domine o Território, Dominó, Dr. Limpeza, Fábrica de Chocolate, Hexágonos, Hockey de Mesa, Icepost Rescue, Junte 4, Master Pinball, Master Pong, Memória Master, Mina Terrestre, Minerador, Nim, Os 12 trabalhos de Jongo, Outsiders, Palhaços, Pense Bem 10 Jogos, Resta Um, Senha, Serpentes, Snowball, Sudoku, Tangram, and Tanques ought to get some sort of representation. If not with a page for each like with Snail Maze, then at least a group page for the bunch.

Author	Message
The King of the Mods Joined: 24 Aug 2014 Posts: 66	Brazilian Repros Posted: Wed May 22, 2024 12:11 pm
The King of the Mods Joined: 24 Aug 2014 Posts: 66	Last time I was checking through Mercado Livre for Brazilian games to add to my collection, I stumbled across a bunch of reproduction games getting cranked out in Brazil. Naturally, I had to get my hands on The Goonies. I gotta say, it looks pretty legit. They put some effort into presentation here. It got me thinking. I know that on this site only official releases of games seem to be cataloged, but I'm strongly under the impression that a good number of Korean games aren't official releases or are ports of games that were ported without permission. It got me wondering what the criteria is on SMSPower for determining whether a game is worthy of official documentation or is simply dismissed as a homebrew, repro, or bootleg. I'm wondering if maybe we shouldn't be taking a second look at some of these games. I'm not looking to complain or stir up trouble, merely a bit curious as to what the criteria is for whether a game does or doesn't get an informational page on this site. Speaking personally, I know my copy of 188 Hap is so glitchy that it's barely playable. I'm not sure what qualifies it for an entry on this site over one of the more polished cartridges being sold on 2Minds, or a copy of Jumping Llama put out by Revo. I'm really curious for some input here. 20240522_041729.jpg (3.1 MB) Case Front 20240522_041807.jpg (2.93 MB) Outer Case 20240522_041831_remastered.jpg (3.3 MB) Cartridge 20240522_041844_remastered.jpg (2.57 MB) Cartridge Back

Bock Site Admin Joined: 08 Jul 2001 Posts: 8675 Location: Paris, France	Posted: Thu May 23, 2024 8:15 am
	The main criteria for cataloguing something under Games/ is whether it was released during the era the system was commercially active. The number of software falling into this criteria in theoretically finite. That means we do try to document bootlegs released in the 90s (e.g. HTH GG releases). Everything else that constitute new software is under Homebrew/ and modifications of existing software under Hacks/. I think it's a good split that align with the initial preservation intent of this website. Nowadays some database use the term "Aftermarket" to refer to any modern releases, I think it's a good term and align with my description above. Whereas the number of software falling into Games/ is finite by definition (and even so, it has been a multi-decade project to find and document them, and we are not done), aftermarket software are only going to grow forever. There are a true gems and labors of love out there, but I think it is viable that we draw a line somewhere in term of how we cover them. Normal copies of 188 Hap should work, sorry yours doesn't :( Which system are you running it on?

The King of the Mods Joined: 24 Aug 2014 Posts: 66	Posted: Thu May 23, 2024 11:59 am
The King of the Mods Joined: 24 Aug 2014 Posts: 66	Bock wrote The main criteria for cataloguing something under Games/ is whether it was released during the era the system was commercially active. The number of software falling into this criteria in theoretically finite. That means we do try to document bootlegs released in the 90s (e.g. HTH GG releases). Everything else that constitute new software is under Homebrew/ and modifications of existing software under Hacks/. I think it's a good split that align with the initial preservation intent of this website. Nowadays some database use the term "Aftermarket" to refer to any modern releases, I think it's a good term and align with my description above. Whereas the number of software falling into Games/ is finite by definition (and even so, it has been a multi-decade project to find and document them, and we are not done), aftermarket software are only going to grow forever. There are a true gems and labors of love out there, but I think it is viable that we draw a line somewhere in term of how we cover them. Normal copies of 188 Hap should work, sorry yours doesn't :( Which system are you running it on? I'm tempted to play devil's advocate and point out that they're still cranking out Master Systems in Brazil to this day, if we're talking commercially active. I still can't believe the Master System beat the Atari 2600's record. i don't even remember the nature of the issues I had with 188 Hap, as they drove me away from playing it and I haven't touched it in a long while. I think I just encountered a lot of glitches when attempting to play it, maybe some locking up or rebooting. I remember having the impression that maybe some of the games would have worked out just fine if it wasn't a multicart.

ApolloBoy Joined: 30 Jan 2007 Posts: 330 Location: San Jose, CA	Posted: Thu May 23, 2024 2:42 pm
	The King of the Mods wrote I'm tempted to play devil's advocate and point out that they're still cranking out Master Systems in Brazil to this day, if we're talking commercially active Although at this point they're basically emulation boxes (and poor emulation boxes at that) that don't actually play original cartridges.

Bock Site Admin Joined: 08 Jul 2001 Posts: 8675 Location: Paris, France	Posted: Thu May 23, 2024 4:21 pm
	The King of the Mods wrote I'm tempted to play devil's advocate and point out that they're still cranking out Master Systems in Brazil to this day, if we're talking commercially active. I guess if TecToy released a new game today I believe we would add it, just like we added https://www.smspower.org/Games/GGAleste3-GG, because I think it has some legitimacy, that a random Goonies repro on ML doesn't have. I realize there's an elements of arbitrary and common-sense choice there to be made anyhow. It's not so important to discuss, I think intuitively you would understand why some items would fit in and some wouldn't.

sverx Joined: 05 Sep 2013 Posts: 3869 Location: Stockholm, Sweden	Posted: Fri May 24, 2024 9:59 am
	Let me play devil's advocate here but I would probably add any commercially released game, maybe with some tag to mark that as 'modern' release (after some specific threshold we should somehow decide...)? I mean, one could argue that 2Minds release are 'homebrew', but would they forever be? What if someone release a new SMS game, would that be an 'homebrew' even if that was a commercial project from the start? I know there's no real solution...

Bock Site Admin Joined: 08 Jul 2001 Posts: 8675 Location: Paris, France	Posted: Fri May 24, 2024 4:11 pm
	We already add them to Homebrew. That specific labeling doesn't matter much, it's fine that they are "commercial". We are far from having accomplished our primary mission to preserve retro games, so as a way to juggle our resources and priorities I think it is important we don't cover modern games the same way.

The King of the Mods Joined: 24 Aug 2014 Posts: 66	Posted: Fri May 24, 2024 9:16 pm
The King of the Mods Joined: 24 Aug 2014 Posts: 66	Bock wrote The King of the Mods wrote I'm tempted to play devil's advocate and point out that they're still cranking out Master Systems in Brazil to this day, if we're talking commercially active. I guess if TecToy released a new game today I believe we would add it, just like we added https://www.smspower.org/Games/GGAleste3-GG, because I think it has some legitimacy, that a random Goonies repro on ML doesn't have. I realize there's an elements of arbitrary and common-sense choice there to be made anyhow. It's not so important to discuss, I think intuitively you would understand why some items would fit in and some wouldn't. So the batch of games included with the Master System Evolution would warrant an entry then?

Bock Site Admin Joined: 08 Jul 2001 Posts: 8675 Location: Paris, France	Posted: Sat May 25, 2024 12:40 pm
	The King of the Mods wrote Bock wrote The King of the Mods wrote I'm tempted to play devil's advocate and point out that they're still cranking out Master Systems in Brazil to this day, if we're talking commercially active. I guess if TecToy released a new game today I believe we would add it, just like we added https://www.smspower.org/Games/GGAleste3-GG, because I think it has some legitimacy, that a random Goonies repro on ML doesn't have. I realize there's an elements of arbitrary and common-sense choice there to be made anyhow. It's not so important to discuss, I think intuitively you would understand why some items would fit in and some wouldn't. So the batch of games included with the Master System Evolution would warrant an entry then? In theory yes, but we also tend to handle "spammy" cases differently and it seems like it would be one of those cases where we would likely create one page grouping all the games. Also to cope with the complexity that there are multiple SMS Evolution and they are likely to have varying software. https://www.smspower.org/Games/HiComTheBestGameCollection-SMS https://www.smspower.org/Games/SegaMasterSystemRom-SMS

The King of the Mods Joined: 24 Aug 2014 Posts: 66	Posted: Sun May 26, 2024 1:18 am
The King of the Mods Joined: 24 Aug 2014 Posts: 66	Bock wrote The King of the Mods wrote Bock wrote The King of the Mods wrote I'm tempted to play devil's advocate and point out that they're still cranking out Master Systems in Brazil to this day, if we're talking commercially active. I guess if TecToy released a new game today I believe we would add it, just like we added https://www.smspower.org/Games/GGAleste3-GG, because I think it has some legitimacy, that a random Goonies repro on ML doesn't have. I realize there's an elements of arbitrary and common-sense choice there to be made anyhow. It's not so important to discuss, I think intuitively you would understand why some items would fit in and some wouldn't. So the batch of games included with the Master System Evolution would warrant an entry then? In theory yes, but we also tend to handle "spammy" cases differently and it seems like it would be one of those cases where we would likely create one page grouping all the games. Also to cope with the complexity that there are multiple SMS Evolution and they are likely to have varying software. https://www.smspower.org/Games/HiComTheBestGameCollection-SMS https://www.smspower.org/Games/SegaMasterSystemRom-SMS However it's done, I think Acerte o Alvo, Aquaduto, Arqueiro, Ataque dos Vermes, Aventuras na Floresta, Batalha Animal, Batalha no Mar, Bolas e Cores, Bolhas, Bombeiros, Cava Cava, Creature Capture, Domine o Território, Dominó, Dr. Limpeza, Fábrica de Chocolate, Hexágonos, Hockey de Mesa, Icepost Rescue, Junte 4, Master Pinball, Master Pong, Memória Master, Mina Terrestre, Minerador, Nim, Os 12 trabalhos de Jongo, Outsiders, Palhaços, Pense Bem 10 Jogos, Resta Um, Senha, Serpentes, Snowball, Sudoku, Tangram, and Tanques ought to get some sort of representation. If not with a page for each like with Snail Maze, then at least a group page for the bunch.

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