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Hi =)
Long story short - is it somehow possible to make a custom physical cartridge with a ROM chip that is greater than 8 Megabit, and that it actually is playable? Shouldn't that technically be possible? Am i mistaken if i think it would just need a custom header? xD

PS: I ask also because of the problematic situation with giant vgm files (especially @YM2413+SN76489) which aren't too development-friendly for bigger projects. Not going to disclose all info now but let's say we might want many many many maps and many songs for the game, haha.

It is possible. but it is difficult... http://www.smspower.org/forums/16416-Working4MBFlashCart#96030

and i guess that instead using a 8bit pager (4 mbytes rom limit - it is actually “weird” that no classic sms game went larger than 1 mbyte, or everdrive still lacks 4 mbytes rom support), i guess would not be possible to make a cartridge using a 16bit pager (1 gbyte rom limit), 32bit pagers (64 tbytes rom limit), but i have no idea how large are the rom chips manufactured nowadays - of course these 16bit or 32bit pagers goes out of the standards (as Korean/Taiway paged roms converted from msx does as well) - so it seems it is all up to the homebrew retro scene on developing some titles for defining such standards (or we, as active in the sms retro scene, creating such documentation, so the developers would follow such specifications), and perhaps we might be seeing them emulated sooner or later

Probably better to build in the code to read data from the SD card file system at some point. It's presumably possible (but maybe a bit slow) and then you can stream data as needed.

I'm for the development of 16-bit mappers myself. More for futureproofing more than anything else.

Who knows what kind of a nutcase will want to release a 64 megabyte game in future, afterall?

I suppose it's not THAT weird no game went about 8-megabit.
That was probably considered enough for 8 bits, at least at that time.
Considering even the competition: no official NES game went above 8 either. Even original Game Boy didn't see 16-megabit games until the Color era (1999+).

I always just assumed it was an expenses thing. ROM chips are quite expensive, y'know. Especially ones that're smaller sized physically. Game Boy cartridges got very cramped.

16 bit games were passing 8Mb before the end of the SMS life, but there was a physical cost issue (which seems to be mostly passed on in the game price) and it seems a conception that 8 bit games didn't deserve the premium. It's also the case that 8 bit systems don't need as much space, because they don't have the capacity to use as much data (simpler graphics and sound takes less space, system RAM limits things like level size). There's no reason not to simply have more data though (more levels, longer music, more graphic changes across levels) - but all that content is expensive to make, and again the system couldn't justify the expense.

In this homebrew age, the only thing making us hit the size boundaries is multimedia content (samples, video).

Surface mount chips were mature enough, the cartridge size wasn't an issue for ROM space, more for extra stuff like save RAM.

Author	Message
Klangfarbe Joined: 21 Oct 2010 Posts: 47 Location: Space	ROM bigger than 8 Megabit? [Noob Question] Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2017 12:46 am
Klangfarbe Joined: 21 Oct 2010 Posts: 47 Location: Space	Hi =) Long story short - is it somehow possible to make a custom physical cartridge with a ROM chip that is greater than 8 Megabit, and that it actually is playable? Shouldn't that technically be possible? Am i mistaken if i think it would just need a custom header? xD PS: I ask also because of the problematic situation with giant vgm files (especially @YM2413+SN76489) which aren't too development-friendly for bigger projects. Not going to disclose all info now but let's say we might want many many many maps and many songs for the game, haha.

psidum Joined: 01 Jan 2014 Posts: 331	Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2017 8:55 am
psidum Joined: 01 Jan 2014 Posts: 331	It is possible. but it is difficult... http://www.smspower.org/forums/16416-Working4MBFlashCart#96030

nitrofurano Joined: 01 Aug 2012 Posts: 322 Location: Porto, Portugal	Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 6:46 pm
	and i guess that instead using a 8bit pager (4 mbytes rom limit - it is actually “weird” that no classic sms game went larger than 1 mbyte, or everdrive still lacks 4 mbytes rom support), i guess would not be possible to make a cartridge using a 16bit pager (1 gbyte rom limit), 32bit pagers (64 tbytes rom limit), but i have no idea how large are the rom chips manufactured nowadays - of course these 16bit or 32bit pagers goes out of the standards (as Korean/Taiway paged roms converted from msx does as well) - so it seems it is all up to the homebrew retro scene on developing some titles for defining such standards (or we, as active in the sms retro scene, creating such documentation, so the developers would follow such specifications), and perhaps we might be seeing them emulated sooner or later

Maxim Site Admin Joined: 19 Oct 1999 Posts: 14738 Location: London	Posted: Tue Feb 07, 2017 8:02 pm
	Probably better to build in the code to read data from the SD card file system at some point. It's presumably possible (but maybe a bit slow) and then you can stream data as needed.

Flygon Joined: 30 Jun 2016 Posts: 196 Location: Melbourne, Australia	Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2017 3:14 am
	I'm for the development of 16-bit mappers myself. More for futureproofing more than anything else. Who knows what kind of a nutcase will want to release a 64 megabyte game in future, afterall?

KingMike Joined: 14 Oct 2008 Posts: 510	Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2017 9:39 pm
KingMike Joined: 14 Oct 2008 Posts: 510	I suppose it's not THAT weird no game went about 8-megabit. That was probably considered enough for 8 bits, at least at that time. Considering even the competition: no official NES game went above 8 either. Even original Game Boy didn't see 16-megabit games until the Color era (1999+).

Flygon Joined: 30 Jun 2016 Posts: 196 Location: Melbourne, Australia	Posted: Wed Feb 08, 2017 11:46 pm
	I always just assumed it was an expenses thing. ROM chips are quite expensive, y'know. Especially ones that're smaller sized physically. Game Boy cartridges got very cramped.

Maxim Site Admin Joined: 19 Oct 1999 Posts: 14738 Location: London	Posted: Thu Feb 09, 2017 7:10 am
	16 bit games were passing 8Mb before the end of the SMS life, but there was a physical cost issue (which seems to be mostly passed on in the game price) and it seems a conception that 8 bit games didn't deserve the premium. It's also the case that 8 bit systems don't need as much space, because they don't have the capacity to use as much data (simpler graphics and sound takes less space, system RAM limits things like level size). There's no reason not to simply have more data though (more levels, longer music, more graphic changes across levels) - but all that content is expensive to make, and again the system couldn't justify the expense. In this homebrew age, the only thing making us hit the size boundaries is multimedia content (samples, video). Surface mount chips were mature enough, the cartridge size wasn't an issue for ROM space, more for extra stuff like save RAM.

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